Revamping Open World Instance Zones - Nightmare Tier

Revamping Open World Instance Zones - Nightmare Tier
This idea/suggestion is Open. You can respond to ask questions or discuss the idea and either vote it up or down if you believe it should or should not be implemented, respectively. Popular suggestions and ideas will be considered by the development team to become reality in-game.
Proposal
Revamping Open World Instance Zones
Justification
This "Player Voice" will help revitalize instanced zones such as the Kkwoir Forest, Ryatt Trail, Ettyyy Hunting Grounds, and Myydril Caverns
Motivation
Encourage more open world interaction and play on this awesome planet!
SWG is a game that lives and thrives based on player interactions and stories. In the modern era, players often find themselves exploring the world alone or only with close friends. This "Player Voice" will help revitalize instanced zones by adding more difficult and rewarinding content. Zones such as the Kkwoir Forest, Ryatt Trail, Ettyyy Hunting Grounds, and Myydril Caverns. This could also lay the groundwork for more instanced adventure zones on new planets like Mustafar or adventure planets like Endor, Dathomir, and Yavin.

SWG gives us a very elegant solution to adding difficulty . For experienced players, the instance selection screen that appears when you enter the Ryatt Trail or Myydril Caverns will be familiar. The idea here is to add this instance window to all instanced zone content. Then take the bottom instance (i.e., Instance 3) and upscale the difficulty within that specific instance of the zone.

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Once you zone in, the difficulty would be scaled to a level determined to be appropriate by the staff . We suggest that this scaling for most zones match normal heroic instance difficulty (Level 85 Silvers and Golds). The one exception here is the Myydril Caverns.

Myydril is a unique situation that should be scaled separately. Because it is an instanced zone within an instanced zone, it should be slightly harder than the Kkwoir Forest, becoming more difficult as you descend and approach the NK instance. For example, initial enemies could be Level 80 silver elites, and the Unsor'is could be Level 85 silver elites, scaling up to Level 90 elites as you approach NK.

The Ryatt Trail could use a similar system, with the difficulty increasing as you approach the Shadow Lands, and the pinnacle of difficulty being the Katarn. It would operate as follows:
  • Level 1 - The Common Paths: Level 77 Silver Elites
  • Level 2 - High Grounds: Level 80 Silver Elites
  • Level 3 - Wroshyr Canopy: Level 83 Silver Elites
  • Level 4 - Web Weaver Path: Level 86 Silver Elites
  • Level 5 - The Shadowed Lands: Level 90 Silver Elites
  • All levels would have the unique named enemies as Gold Elites of the same level (i.e., Katarn and Scratch would be lvl 90 Gold Elites).
Let's talk about why players should want to play this content:
  • Zones would reward Augs and Enhancers at the Normal Heroic level.
  • Myydril Caverns would be a great place to add a new material, Nak’tra Crystals.
  • Should not change any quest lines, but if you have not completed a quest line, you should be able to enjoy a more challenging experience.
  • Offer a significant XP increase (a 50% XP buff in Kkwoir Forest, Ryatt Trail, and Ettyyy Hunting Grounds, and a 75% increase in Myydril Caverns)
  • Improved harvesting for Hide/Meat/Bone (100–300% Harvesting Bonus).
  • Should reward more valuable junk loot. The loot table should be the same as higher-end content, like Nightsisters.
  • Introduce the Sayormi and Outcasts as an alternative Holocron farm for Sith Meditate and Waistpack Collection drops.
  • Should drop only 89+ Isomerase Enzymes and provide high quality Hydrolase Enzyme farming

This content is intended to require group play in these zones. However, we acknowledge that some builds will have advantages. CHs and Jedi may be able to solo parts of this content; however, given the nature of these zones, it would be high risk/high reward for most Jedi players.

For Jedi in particular, visibility tics should increase in these zones, which should lead to some excellent interactions with Bounty Hunters/Inquisitors/Vader. As far as CHs and other niche builds, this zone should be rewarding for those who choose a “soloing” build.

UPDATE: Due to the nature of this change we are removing the loot section of this PV. Loot & rewards are always determined by Staff and Senators so we would hate to see the PV weighed down by loot concerns.
 
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I would love to know what your thoughts are, maybe its something that can be adjusted!
I will give you 1 reason not all as I really do not want the arguments. When you said the statement below did you think it through?

  • Should drop only 89+ Isomerase Enzymes and provide high quality Hydrolase Enzyme farming.

    So this turns it into the only place to really get these things and oh sorry cupcakes if you are a solo player you are sol and just have to find a new way or place to farm these things or be forced into group play to get them.
 
Downvote due to most of the specific loot proposals undercutting other content. Motivation cannot just be stolen from other places in the game because layers will generally choose the optimal path.
 
Wow this is bad... This reeks of "I need a quiet spot to level my jedi and my buddies while making massive profits"

Lot of ideas lately trying to turn this game into "free farm easy mode"... there are a lot of other mmorpgs out there that cater to just that (or even other SWG servers for that matter), let's not turn Restoration into one of them, it was never the intention of the original developers and the resto devs have made it clear it's not theirs either. This is a sandbox, not a theme park. There have been far better ideas and PVs to make some of the Kashyyyk content more relevant to today's standards, this is not it.
 
I will give you 1 reason not all as I really do not want the arguments. When you said the statement below did you think it through?

  • Should drop only 89+ Isomerase Enzymes and provide high quality Hydrolase Enzyme farming.

    So this turns it into the only place to really get these things and oh sorry cupcakes if you are a solo player you are sol and just have to find a new way or place to farm these things or be forced into group play to get them.

Is the issue in particular with the Hydros? I definitely don't mind removing that but I feel like with spin groups 89+ Isos are so common this is basically harmless?
 
Wow this is bad... This reeks of "I need a quiet spot to level my jedi and my buddies while making massive profits"

Lot of ideas lately trying to turn this game into "free farm easy mode"... there are a lot of other mmorpgs out there that cater to just that (or even other SWG servers for that matter), let's not turn Restoration into one of them, it was never the intention of the original developers and the resto devs have made it clear it's not theirs either. This is a sandbox, not a theme park. There have been far better ideas and PVs to make some of the Kashyyyk content more relevant to today's standards, this is not it.

Actually the visibility mechanic makes it not an ideal place to level your Jedi. You chance of getting hunted in some of these zones as NPCs are more common that creatures in a lot of them.

Also as far as the sandbox comment adding zones anyone can access and play together would make it more of a sandbox that adding more 8 player instances.
 
Is the issue in particular with the Hydros? I definitely don't mind removing that but I feel like with spin groups 89+ Isos are so common this is basically harmless?
Except a spin group doesn't generate only 89s. The massive xp gains, the extra holo farm, the extra junk loot, the extra creature resources, all of these are just ways to bypass a TON of the current farm content behind an instance. Silver elites are not that hard to kill outside and do not reward any of those things, why should all the mobs of an instance suddenly give you that many rewards?
This is just a means to make one area the be-all end-all of game content. Not only would it create a massive unfair advantage to lower level players who often rely on these resources to make credits, it would also completely rock the economy into shambles, further discouraging new players from farming such things and turning a profit and continue to line the pockets of already wealthy players. There are not enough things on this PV you could change to make it viable.
 
Downvote due to most of the specific loot proposals undercutting other content. Motivation cannot just be stolen from other places in the game because layers will generally choose the optimal path.
Assuming this is about the Aug's and Enhancers? Would a range restriction help this?
 
Actually the visibility mechanic makes it not an ideal place to level your Jedi. You chance of getting hunted in some of these zones as NPCs are more common that creatures in a lot of them.

Also as far as the sandbox comment adding zones anyone can access and play together would make it more of a sandbox that adding more 8 player instances.
None of those zones allow for mounts to be used, this means a jedi could "wait" for a group of BHs at the end of an instance and zoom past them back to the door while they have to mount their slow ass mounts and attempt to catch up... again, no.
 
Except a spin group doesn't generate only 89s. The massive xp gains, the extra holo farm, the extra junk loot, the extra creature resources, all of these are just ways to bypass a TON of the current farm content behind an instance. Silver elites are not that hard to kill outside and do not reward any of those things, why should all the mobs of an instance suddenly give you that many rewards?
This is just a means to make one area the be-all end-all of game content. Not only would it create a massive unfair advantage to lower level players who often rely on these resources to make credits, it would also completely rock the economy into shambles, further discouraging new players from farming such things and turning a profit and continue to line the pockets of already wealthy players. There are not enough things on this PV you could change to make it viable.
I think that this would hold untrue. I specifically mentioned that the scaling should still reward soloing builds. But I'll be honest while I think there should be rewarding loot I am open to letting staff decide all loot involved here. I am just trying to provide more examples that make sense within the lore and answer common player concerns. Like being gate kept out of higher end content due to time commitments or build choice.

I appreciate the feedback though. would it help you i made it more clear that all loot is at staff discretion?
 
Currently, the way nightmare scaling works is already really bad. Larger health pools and higher chance to evade attacks just sucks as is, let alone adding it to open PVE content.
  • Zones would reward Augs and Enhancers at the Normal Heroic level.
  • Myydril Caverns would be a great place to add a new material, Nak’tra Crystals. No idea why we are adding new materials? What would the purpose of these materials be? This should be outlined in the PV if you're suggesting it.
  • Should not change any quest lines, but if you have not completed a quest line, you should be able to enjoy a more challenging experience. Nothing wrong with more challenging content but this is exactly the issue we have with NM heroics already. The difficulty basically equates to enemies being harder to hit, no new mechanics nothing interesting or actually challenging, wouldn't want this to follow suit at all.
  • Offer a significant XP increase (a 50% XP buff in Kkwoir Forest, Ryatt Trail, and Ettyyy Hunting Grounds, and a 75% increase in Myydril Caverns) If this is considered end game content, i dont know why an XP increase would be given here?
  • Improved harvesting for Hide/Meat/Bone (100–300% Harvesting Bonus). Someone with better crafting knowledge can feedback on this, i am sure, not notes from me
  • Should reward more valuable junk loot. The loot table should be the same as higher-end content, like Nightsisters.
  • Introduce the Sayormi and Outcasts as an alternative Holocron farm for Sith Meditate and Waistpack Collection drops.
  • Should drop only 89+ Isomerase Enzymes and provide high quality Hydrolase Enzyme farming.

    The last three points seem to all be aimed at making Kash a good place to go for farming etc. In all honesty i just don't think this is good content. Sure we could add more places to farm valuable items but wouldn't it be better to focus energy on creating new experiences on Kash rather than replacing the farming you already do with on different planets and just adding it to kashyyyk?



Overall definitely dont think this is a good idea, Kashyyyk needs an uplift and an overhaul, but this aint it imo
 
None of those zones allow for mounts to be used, this means a jedi could "wait" for a group of BHs at the end of an instance and zoom past them back to the door while they have to mount their slow ass mounts and attempt to catch up... again, no.
Jedi can literally do this in QZ. Didn't stop it from implementation.
 
None of those zones allow for mounts to be used, this means a jedi could "wait" for a group of BHs at the end of an instance and zoom past them back to the door while they have to mount their slow ass mounts and attempt to catch up... again, no.
Ground mounts are use-able in the Ettyy, and Kkowir Forest. However I think froma BH perspective you would have to accept that you dont ALWAYS get the easy kill.
 
Downvote due to most of the specific loot proposals undercutting other content. Motivation cannot just be stolen from other places in the game because layers will generally choose the optimal path.
Agreed, adding a 'one stop shop' for end-game doesn't help anything. The exp buffs for a supposed end-game zone seem a bizarre choice, smells like the ask is a cozy nook for jedi to grind xp/creds.
 
Currently, the way nightmare scaling works is already really bad. Larger health pools and higher chance to evade attacks just sucks as is, let alone adding it to open PVE content.
  • Zones would reward Augs and Enhancers at the Normal Heroic level.
  • Myydril Caverns would be a great place to add a new material, Nak’tra Crystals. No idea why we are adding new materials? What would the purpose of these materials be? This should be outlined in the PV if you're suggesting it.
  • Should not change any quest lines, but if you have not completed a quest line, you should be able to enjoy a more challenging experience. Nothing wrong with more challenging content but this is exactly the issue we have with NM heroics already. The difficulty basically equates to enemies being harder to hit, no new mechanics nothing interesting or actually challenging, wouldn't want this to follow suit at all.
  • Offer a significant XP increase (a 50% XP buff in Kkwoir Forest, Ryatt Trail, and Ettyyy Hunting Grounds, and a 75% increase in Myydril Caverns) If this is considered end game content, i dont know why an XP increase would be given here?
  • Improved harvesting for Hide/Meat/Bone (100–300% Harvesting Bonus). Someone with better crafting knowledge can feedback on this, i am sure, not notes from me
  • Should reward more valuable junk loot. The loot table should be the same as higher-end content, like Nightsisters.
  • Introduce the Sayormi and Outcasts as an alternative Holocron farm for Sith Meditate and Waistpack Collection drops.
  • Should drop only 89+ Isomerase Enzymes and provide high quality Hydrolase Enzyme farming.

    The last three points seem to all be aimed at making Kash a good place to go for farming etc. In all honesty i just don't think this is good content. Sure we could add more places to farm valuable items but wouldn't it be better to focus energy on creating new experiences on Kash rather than replacing the farming you already do with on different planets and just adding it to kashyyyk?



Overall definitely dont think this is a good idea, Kashyyyk needs an uplift and an overhaul, but this aint it imo

To be clear this would not be scaled to nightmare difficulty. It is simply the Servers word of choice for hard "Heroic" content.

Ive mentioned this in other comments but I am totally fine removing the loot specifics I was just meant to be a starting point on a conversation.
 
To be clear this would not be scaled to nightmare difficulty. It is simply the Servers word of choice for hard "Heroic" content.

Ive mentioned this in other comments but I am totally fine removing the loot specifics I was just meant to be a starting point on a conversation.
I like the idea of a hard zone. I don't know why people are getting so wrapped up on the loot or xp specifics which can be adjusted. The idea of bringing players to Kashyyyk for content is a good one.
 
I like the idea of a hard zone. I don't know why people are getting so wrapped up on the loot or xp specifics which can be adjusted. The idea of bringing players to Kashyyyk for content is a good one.
There was a recent PV to address the hunting questline in Kashyyyk which basically addresses the issue for needing harder content in Kashyyyk. From what I remember, that PV was very well received and thought through. It also involved group content within an instance (a time gated instance).
This PV started as "let's make it really hard content (but also soloable) with amazing loot and extra -everything-" to "let's just make it hard and we can forget about the loot", so what exactly is the point? If you want mobs that hit harder which require group play, that's already a thing and it's got a mound of issues of its own.

Here are three recent PVs addressing Kashyyyk content.


Two of these are even written by the OP of this very PV. They are far better thought out and put together than this one which, in my opinion and the one of a lot of others it seems, just trivializes current ways to acquire resources and rarer loot for the sake of mobs that hit harder. If we take away the loot and resources as has been suggested by the OP, we're left with mobs that hit harder. This already exists and itself needs addressed before more instances of "mobs that hit harder" are introduced to the game.