Feedback Needed - Give actual Scouting Abilities back to Scouts and Rangers. | SWG Restoration III

Feedback Needed Give actual Scouting Abilities back to Scouts and Rangers.

This idea/suggestion has been flagged as Feedback Needed by the development team. See the post from the developers asking for follow-up discussion or alternative suggestions to discuss.
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Proposal
I would like the Scout to be able to make and use Traps again, and the Ranger to be able to track animals once more. I would also like the Scout and Ranger's camps to be of use. Give the Scouts and Rangers their character and purpose back, please!
Motivation
When I played the original SWG my Scout character could make and use actual traps (not the flash bangs we have now), and could self heal to an extent while playing a musical intrument in his camp. As a Ranger he could track animals. None of this is present in Restoration.
Justification
All the aspects that gave the Scout and Ranger character and identity have been stripped out. The Scout and Ranger paths feel empty, almost pointless, without them.
Back in the day, when I played the original SWG, I played a hermit Scout/Ranger character. He wandered the wilderness, rarely visiting settlements, living off of the creatures he encountered. He tracked animals, trapped them with real traps of his own making, hunted and harvested their skin, meat and bone, then built himself camps (and food) from those resources and healed himself while he rested out in the wild. He could sustain himself almost indefinately without the need to ever meet another person, should he have chosen to. When he did need resources, he could hire himself out as tracker, trapper and hunter.

This does not exist in Restoration. This hermit character is impossible in Restoration.
 
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Altho scout never had tacking i believe, that was a ranger thing. I would love it if they give ranger there tracking skill Animals/humans ( so ranger ones again can help BH's ) and their camps back. I do wonder what the reason was for them to give the ranger camps to architect's. I hope the ranger rework will give ranger purpose again other than the 20 DNA harvesting skill ( 10 at novice, 10 at master )
 
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Altho scout never had tacking i believe, that was a ranger thing. I would love it if they give ranger there tracking skill Animals/humans ( so ranger ones again can help BH's ) and their camps back. I do wonder what the reason was for them to give the ranger camps to architect's. I hope the ranger rework will give ranger purpose again other than the 20 DNA harvesting skill ( 10 at novice, 10 at master )
Thank you for the input. It was a LONG time ago and my middle aged memory is not as sharp as it used to be. My Scout must have gone on to the Ranger path back then. But yeah, I think the comments stand, give the Scout (and Ranger) back their skills. :)

I will see if I can edit my proposal accordingly. :)
 
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I like where R3 is taking Rangers. They seem to be moving to a more direct combat oriented roll. The master scout requiremet needs to go, imo. There's just not enough there for the skill investment. Tracking was clunky and ineffective in all but the most isolated of circumstances. You earned the ability to track at longer range and could track creatures>npcs>players as you advanced up the Tracking line of Ranger.

I really DO NOT want Ranger to be returned to the mobile organics harvesters they were on live, keep that stuff in scout.
 
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I like where R3 is taking Rangers. They seem to be moving to a more direct combat oriented roll. The master scout requiremet needs to go, imo. There's just not enough there for the skill investment. Tracking was clunky and ineffective in all but the most isolated of circumstances. You earned the ability to track at longer range and could track creatures>npcs>players as you advanced up the Tracking line of Ranger.

I really DO NOT want Ranger to be returned to the mobile organics harvesters they were on live, keep that stuff in scout.
Than what do u prupose that ranger will become? Or what ranger should have? Ranger being a havester helps with getting money for when u go master ranger. Right now it has nothing worth while. No camps, No tracking. I just hope we hear something soon for the rework cause ill drop my secondary skill in a hearthbeat for master CH/ Master Ranger if ranger is worth it!
 
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Than what do u prupose that ranger will become? Or what ranger should have? Ranger being a havester helps with getting money for when u go master ranger. Right now it has nothing worth while. No camps, No tracking. I just hope we hear something soon for the rework cause ill drop my secondary skill in a hearthbeat for master CH/ Master Ranger if ranger is worth it!
Well I'll admit I'm still new to R3. My 1st build at launch was MRifles/MRanger, (huge mistake!) Rangers stealth/Camo and trapping skills on R3 look pretty interesting depending on how exactly they work, ie not just on creatures. Harvesting, tracking, camping, TN should all be contained with the Scout "Normal" profession. Leaving Ranger to be geared more toward direct Combat skills as an "elite" profession. Would make for some interesting builds while still leaving the opportunity to be a Master Scout/Master Ranger mobile harvestor, tracker for hire, etc. it's always been.
 
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I like where R3 is taking Rangers. They seem to be moving to a more direct combat oriented roll. The master scout requiremet needs to go, imo. There's just not enough there for the skill investment. Tracking was clunky and ineffective in all but the most isolated of circumstances. You earned the ability to track at longer range and could track creatures>npcs>players as you advanced up the Tracking line of Ranger.

I really DO NOT want Ranger to be returned to the mobile organics harvesters they were on live, keep that stuff in scout.
Honestly the mobile harvester thing is really appealing to some of us and one simple change would make Ranger very viable in Combat. Make the traps work on players and npcs. That would make the ranger a very effective debuff combat profession.
 
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I would almost like to see the higher end camps function more like deeds. What if you could load up max functionality crafting stations into the luxury camps and Master Rangers could drop the same one down? Plus, make wounds only healable at camps and medical centers unless you can meditate.

Maybe a component for a vehicle garage if your vehicles get destroyed in the field? Or even make ITV travel free from a Ranger Camp (No fuel cell or credit cost)?

Or, let Rangers build the camps that look like they are actually made from hide, and keep the fancy ones made by architect, but only deployable by Rangers. Only reason people use the camps these days are for shuttle beacons... Give Rangers more purpose. Also, once you hit Master Scout, there is no additional bonus to be gained to harvesting resources by going Ranger. I think that extra bonus should be gained at Master Ranger instead of Master Scout. (I'm fully aware of the DNA bonus at Master Ranger, but it seems that harvesting should have the bonus too)

Or make certain camps deployable based on group size. Would be cool if the camps set up with a group of 8 were just epic compared to travelling alone...

Finally, Ranger used to be the master at Terrain Negotiation, especially for prone movement and burst run duration. Bring that back, as well as group terrain negotiation like they used to have. Rifleman/Ranger with an actual fast crawl would be so much fun again.

As far as combat, give Conceal/Concealed Shot to Ranger instead of Rifleman.

Just some thoughts....
 
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I would almost like to see the higher end camps function more like deeds. What if you could load up max functionality crafting stations into the luxury camps and Master Rangers could drop the same one down? Plus, make wounds only healable at camps and medical centers unless you can meditate.

Maybe a component for a vehicle garage if your vehicles get destroyed in the field? Or even make ITV travel free from a Ranger Camp (No fuel cell or credit cost)?

Or, let Rangers build the camps that look like they are actually made from hide, and keep the fancy ones made by architect, but only deployable by Rangers. Only reason people use the camps these days are for shuttle beacons... Give Rangers more purpose. Also, once you hit Master Scout, there is no additional bonus to be gained to harvesting resources by going Ranger. I think that extra bonus should be gained at Master Ranger instead of Master Scout. (I'm fully aware of the DNA bonus at Master Ranger, but it seems that harvesting should have the bonus too)

Or make certain camps deployable based on group size. Would be cool if the camps set up with a group of 8 were just epic compared to travelling alone...

Finally, Ranger used to be the master at Terrain Negotiation, especially for prone movement and burst run duration. Bring that back, as well as group terrain negotiation like they used to have. Rifleman/Ranger with an actual fast crawl would be so much fun again.

As far as combat, give Conceal/Concealed Shot to Ranger instead of Rifleman.

Just some thoughts....
I like your ideas. I would however tweak your camp ideas and your combat suggestion. First, I would completely take camps away from architect beyond a deployable base type of structure for GCW type activity. I however would like to see them decrease the resource demand for camp modules architect crafted and allow rangers and scouts to purchase these modules to add in their crafted camps. I would like to see the master ranger field base camps use lots and be permanent structures with the ability to hold many modules. The Ranger base could have power and maintenance requirements just like a harvester.

For combat it is simple. Make the traps crafted and consumable like grenades already are and make them work on everything attackable in game even players and NPCs. Grant special bonuses vs pets (I think commando already has vs droids....I could be wrong) and beef up general combat skill mods to align with smuggler or similar.
You are right about conceal shot. Rifles need a shot that doesn't require being concealed to use that they can kick butt while in active combat poor guys only have headshot. There....Combat fixed.
 

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Ranger is slated for refactoring with Publish 1.1.

We are happy to consider more changes in the spirit of what is suggested here, but please articulate specific changes requested in lieu of broad ideas.

"I would like the Scout to be able to make and use Traps again" -> Good

"And the Ranger to be able to track animals once more." -> Good

"I would also like the Scout and Ranger's camps to be of use." What does "of use" mean? How should it work? What should it require?

"and could self heal to an extent while playing a musical instrument in his camp" -> You want scouts to have musician skills?

"Give the Scouts and Rangers their character and purpose back, please!" -> Is this just a summation of the above requests?
 
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Ranger is slated for refactoring with Publish 1.1.

We are happy to consider more changes in the spirit of what is suggested here, but please articulate specific changes requested in lieu of broad ideas.

"I would like the Scout to be able to make and use Traps again" -> Good

"And the Ranger to be able to track animals once more." -> Good

"I would also like the Scout and Ranger's camps to be of use." What does "of use" mean? How should it work? What should it require?

"and could self heal to an extent while playing a musical instrument in his camp" -> You want scouts to have musician skills?

"Give the Scouts and Rangers their character and purpose back, please!" -> Is this just a summation of the above requests?
I would honestly like Rangers to get back the functions that they had in the Pre-CU and Cu (Traps, Camps, Terrain Negotiation, Tracking, Harvesting Bonuses that keep climbing, etc) as well as keeping certain things from the new batch that make sense (ala the Bonuses for the DNA Harvesting). One reason I really liked Rangers was the concept/feeling that they were masters of survival out in the wilds by themselves through being self sufficient (and with the Points being needed to get there, they really should be), though I am certainly not objectional to some new things being added to increase Group Desirability as well. Even with the high number of Points needed to get in (And let's face it, they are HIGH compared to other classes), there are still enough Points left over to get at least one other Combat Profession to Master.

I will ask, However, to leave the More Urban related stuff (Stealing, Explosives and such) to other classes. I believe that things like Landmines of all types (Proximity, timer, remote detonation, etc, eyc) or other kinds of explosives should be moved to Commando (Shameless plug since they are getting reworked at the same time). I saw the options that were sitting for things like Toxic Dart Traps and Caltrops, and THOSE I did like as Ranger things since they make thematical sense to me and definitely should stay in. As some of the others said above, make the traps effect Players as well that way Rangers can contribute in a variety of ways for GCW and even PvP.

Anyways, just some of my thoughts on the matter..
 
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Although I don't play any of both professions, I can certainly see how it would add to the variety of characters that are being created, great idea!
 
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Ideas for Ranger
1) Non-combat group speed bonus - not burst. Must have a cool down after combat so that it can't be used / abused entering / exiting combat.
2) Rangers get an increase in foraging, milking, nest searching, animal harvest percentage yield
3) Ranger placed camps last twice as long and can be reused a number of times (say 5) This makes it more likely that a ranger might have a $45k crafting machine if it doesn't disappear after one use.
4) A tool used only by a ranger that accepts an animal resource then allows the ranger to track an animal matching the resource. The tools requires two resources and will track creatures that have only both resources in the tool. (i.e. On Naboo, the ranger places leathery hide and herbavor meat in the tool and it would track for Fambas. If the ranger places leather hide and avian meat, the tool would track for Peko Pekos.)
1) Tool generates the lair as if it was a mission lair.
2) Tool does not give mission rewards.
3) Tool quality determines number of waypoints and distance to reach the lair.
4) Using the tool consumes the resource and decreases tool durability.
5) Tool durability is not repairable (this will provide a market for the tools).
6) Tool is crafted by a droid engineer and is a mid-level complexity.

Also, IMHO, Buffs from a Squad Leader should focus towards combat. Buffs from a Ranger should focus towards non-combat stats.
 
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Scout Camp rework ideas
  • Basic Camp Kit: Harvest Bonus
  • Multiperson Camp Kit: Fishing Bonus
  • Improved Camp Kit: Egg Finding/Milking Bonus
  • High Quality Camp Kit: Forage Bonus
  • Field Base Kit: Explorer Terminal
  • High Tech Field Base Kit: Mission Terminal
Only Scouts (with the corresponding skill boxes) should be able to drop the camps, but anybody can benefit from what they provide. The higher tier camps maintain all the functionality of the camps in a lower tier (so a High Tech Field Base Kit would be able to do everything). How I imagine the bonuses would work is they require a player to spend a short amount of time inside the camp, after which they receive a long duration buff that grants them the respective bonuses.

These chosen bonuses reinforce the Scout's role as a Creature Resource gatherer, and being able to drop an Explorer/Mission terminal out in the wilderness also synergises well with this playstyle. They also do not overlap functionality with Architect Camps, thus ensuring they are both relevant but in different ways.
 
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