This idea/suggestion is Open. You can respond to ask questions or discuss the idea and either vote it up or down if you believe it should or should not be implemented, respectively. Popular suggestions and ideas will be considered by the development team to become reality in-game.
Wilykitt

Wilykitt

Proposal
Once you accept Padawan you are unable to accept player bounties.
Justification
Being a deliberate split Normie/Jedi build is already against the spirit of Jedi class which is its own self contained grouping of classes.

Doing so to mine/maxing player bounty hunting whilst teaming up with other bounty hunters to abuse Sever, Drain Force, Stasis etc is frustrating PvP experience for the player jedi.

Being a Force Sensitive BH would be more friendly, but being a Jedi/BH certainly is not and is immersion breaking.

Lastly this also makes balancing Jedi/BH interactions significantly harder when one side can be both sides or the coin.
Motivation
Keep the systems clean and provide more nuanced and balanced bounty hunter experience for both sides. Clear up lore breaking actions that are clearly for sweaty PvP try hards :)
Have a multi spec Bounty Hunter/Jedi is lore breaking, PvP min maxing play that isn't at home on Resto. It creates frustrating plays for the Jedi being hunted, and makes future balancing significantly harder.
 
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I don't know that I get the difference in a Jedi/BH vs a Jedi/Inquisitor, or think it's lore breaking.

So if I understand correctly, your primary complaint is that it's immersion breaking and unfair, is that correct? I would like to point out that in lore, Bounty Hunters and Inquisitors are never under any obligation or code to be fair. I also can't imagine anything immersion breaking about having Duelist Stance as a Jedi, why wouldn't they be able to have a Duelist Stance or use droids?. If we're talking about situations: Bounty Hunters can roll in packs against normal characters, which is incredibly unfair, why not have a Jedi/BH along for the ride against a tougher foe? For Immersion in the sense of a characters identity, maybe they've been in hiding and need the cash, or maybe they were hired by the Empire to be a Sith Assassin, Emporer's Hand, etc. If you think the balance is jacked now, what are you thinking will happen when you are fighting against BH's that are going after you for money, and now the Inquisitor proper is on you for blood sport? I don't think Jedi need anymore safe guards, when you grab the BH line as a Jedi, you sacrifice tons of Force Power, the majority of your Healing or Offensive ability, just to intercept people that have more power than you.
 
JamakaDoodle said:
I don't know that I get the difference in a Jedi/BH vs a Jedi/Inquisitor, or think it's lore breaking.

So if I understand correctly, your primary complaint is that it's immersion breaking and unfair, is that correct? I would like to point out that in lore, Bounty Hunters and Inquisitors are never under any obligation or code to be fair. I also can't imagine anything immersion breaking about having Duelist Stance as a Jedi, why wouldn't they be able to have a Duelist Stance or use droids?. If we're talking about situations: Bounty Hunters can roll in packs against normal characters, which is incredibly unfair, why not have a Jedi/BH along for the ride against a tougher foe? For Immersion in the sense of a characters identity, maybe they've been in hiding and need the cash, or maybe they were hired by the Empire to be a Sith Assassin, Emporer's Hand, etc. If you think the balance is jacked now, what are you thinking will happen when you are fighting against BH's that are going after you for money, and now the Inquisitor proper is on you for blood sport? I don't think Jedi need anymore safe guards, when you grab the BH line as a Jedi, you sacrifice tons of Force Power, the majority of your Healing or Offensive ability, just to intercept people that have more power than you.
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This PV is a little defunct as it's been addressed in the Jedi only discord but I'll respond for clarity.

Lore wise, I'm less bothered about compared to game balance but I will address both.

Lore: the traditional BHs in canon are either fallen Jedi or FS BHs. It's the use of overt force powers to debilitate an opponent solely to allow two other Normie BHs to win that isn't present in Star Wars. I would have no issue if it was an Inquisitor (full Jedi abilities) that hunted Jedi for doctrine or FS BHs (normal skills but with enhanced accuracy, speed and defence due to force sensitivity). The Jedi builds that BH in the game are traditionally 4xxx BH and then Powers/Enhancer/healer enough to just drain force, Stasis and sever whilst maintaining enough utility (FR, FA, heals) to keep themselves alive.

Which brings me into game balance...

The current set up is balanced around one Jedi = 2 or 3 normies in combat strength. Especially if they get the jump and are fully buffed and coordinating together.

When one of those is a Jedi who can Stasis you and then continuously force drain you whilst you can do absolutely NOTHING about it is exploiting the combat system as any offensive action should break mez. It's also done with the explicit knowledge that you are gimping you jedi to just benefit the BH(s) you're running with as you can run down the Jedi's force super quick. It's already been stated that this is unintended.

My issue from a game balance perspective is that there is no interaction or counterplay here from the Jedi being hunted. The Devs seem happy to ban Jedi who grind chronicles in their Yacht but blatantly ignore exploitative behaviour from the BH population.

Any more on this issue I'm happy to take to tells or Discord voice to discuss
 
I haven't really seen this in action. But I can relate to, and imagine how silly it seems to avoid the effect of dying just by "swimming to safety". On the other hand, I can also relate to how silly it is that people who have spent as low as 4-5 hours to max out a bounty hunter can overwhelm a player that has spent between 6 and 18 months in the game to finish their "alpha-class" jedi.
Sure, some take longer, some take shorter (to make both Jedi and Bounty Hunter). Fully templated Jedi in good gear is STRONG, I agree. But a noob-BH with good gear is no slouch either.

But back on topic. Becoming a bounty hunter that is strong enough and reputable enough to hunt the fabled (player controlled) Jedi, surely must be a character of undisputable prowess, right!
Thus, the topic of this thread was just that - making those professions equally exclusive. Have a similar "unlock"-system for "Master" BH, that when all done and said, can and will be able to hunt Jedi who are careless enough to expose themselves. When we reach that point, maybe we can even start the question of balance between them. And most important, the hunt is done by THAT one bountyhunter, not him (her or it) and friends. No decent bountyhunter that care even the slightest about reputation would ever bring someone else along that might steal the show (or glory).

(Sorry if my grammar doesn't come out just right, english is not my native tongue).

I have big, carefully thought out ideas of how this could be implemented and made to fit everyone. To keep the "flashlight" density low at the same time as even more people will feel engagement and find the system enjoyable and the game worth playing at all levels. Oh well. It's a sensitive topic...
 
Wilykitt said:
Have a multi spec Bounty Hunter/Jedi is lore breaking, PvP min maxing play that isn't at home on Resto. It creates frustrating plays for the Jedi being hunted, and makes future balancing significantly harder.
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Jedi loses in PVP and wants a nerf. Some things never change. :ROFLMAO:

Your argument is laughable. Glow stick wielders during the Empire Strikes Back era is lore and immersion breaking. Jedi should be perma deathed after the third incap as was originally planned. That would help greatly with lore and immersion.

Learn to adapt.

Major downvote.
 
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Mork said:
I haven't really seen this in action. But I can relate to, and imagine how silly it seems to avoid the effect of dying just by "swimming to safety". On the other hand, I can also relate to how silly it is that people who have spent as low as 4-5 hours to max out a bounty hunter can overwhelm a player that has spent between 6 and 18 months in the game to finish their "alpha-class" jedi.
Sure, some take longer, some take shorter (to make both Jedi and Bounty Hunter). Fully templated Jedi in good gear is STRONG, I agree. But a noob-BH with good gear is no slouch either.

But back on topic. Becoming a bounty hunter that is strong enough and reputable enough to hunt the fabled (player controlled) Jedi, surely must be a character of undisputable prowess, right!
Thus, the topic of this thread was just that - making those professions equally exclusive. Have a similar "unlock"-system for "Master" BH, that when all done and said, can and will be able to hunt Jedi who are careless enough to expose themselves. When we reach that point, maybe we can even start the question of balance between them. And most important, the hunt is done by THAT one bountyhunter, not him (her or it) and friends. No decent bountyhunter that care even the slightest about reputation would ever bring someone else along that might steal the show (or glory).

(Sorry if my grammar doesn't come out just right, english is not my native tongue).

I have big, carefully thought out ideas of how this could be implemented and made to fit everyone. To keep the "flashlight" density low at the same time as even more people will feel engagement and find the system enjoyable and the game worth playing at all levels. Oh well. It's a sensitive topic...
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I would be all for balance between the two professions so that grouping wasn't needed. The trouble is, this will always get pushback from Jedi players who want to protect their alpha status. Back when this game was live, any build that was able to one on one a Jedi got nerfed: Combat Medic, Rifles, TK, etc. etc. After awhile, it got to the point that people figured out that Jedi was the only way to compete in PVP so they dropped what they really liked playing to become one.

That's why I always pushback on people that claim "Everyone wants to be a Jedi." No. Everyone wanted to become a Jedi because
1.) It was the alpha class
2.) Jedi had an actual progression system
3.) Dev time was always spent catering to Jedi either thru content updates or nerfs to everyone else.

Give other classes a progression system similar to Jedi and you will see a massive difference in what people choose to play. Give BH a place to become Mandolorians. Give Smugglers a way to progress their profession with Han Solo as their guide. Give TK a way to progress from characters from the EU. Add Spy or Agent as a progression for ranged types. It's probably too much to ask , but its always something I wished was done back when this was live. It would have solved so many problems.
 
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FOC said:
Jedi loses in PVP and wants a nerf. Some things never change. :ROFLMAO:

Your argument is laughable. Glow stick wielders during the Empire Strikes Back era is lore and immersion breaking. Jedi should be perma deathed after the third incap as was originally planned. That would help greatly with lore and immersion.

Learn to adapt.

Major downvote.
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Pathetic little keyboard warrior 🤣

I didn't lose to anyone lad. You assume much. Back to your cave, tiny troll.
 
FOC said:
I would be all for balance between the two professions so that grouping wasn't needed. The trouble is, this will always get pushback from Jedi players who want to protect their alpha status. Back when this game was live, any build that was able to one on one a Jedi got nerfed: Combat Medic, Rifles, TK, etc. etc. After awhile, it got to the point that people figured out that Jedi was the only way to compete in PVP so they dropped what they really liked playing to become one.

That's why I always pushback on people that claim "Everyone wants to be a Jedi." No. Everyone wanted to become a Jedi because
1.) It was the alpha class
2.) Jedi had an actual progression system
3.) Devs time was always spent catering to Jedi

Give other classes a progression system similar to Jedi and you will see a massive difference in what people choose to play. Give BH a place to become Mandolorians. Give Smugglers a way to progress their profession with Han Solo as their guide. Give TK a way to progress from characters from the EU. Add Spy or Agent as a progression for ranged types. It's probably too much to ask , but its always something I wished was done back when this was live. It would have solved so many problems.
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They tried that. It is called NGE and was awful. Plus it does not function that way here. Thank you for trolling have a nice bridgey day.
 
Tyr said:
They tried that. It is called NGE and was awful. Plus it does not function that way here. Thank you for trolling have a nice bridgey day.
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1,) Making suggestions is not trolling.
2.) I already stated that would probably never happen.
3.) Adding questlines was not the reason for NGE failing. The gutting of professions and dropping it in a buggy state so soon after the Obi Wan expansion was why it failed..
4.) If you are so against NGE, why are you playing a version that has the NGE Legacy Questline? If you think that's fine, then what's the problem with adding other profession content?

Have a nice day as well and try not to be so salty.
 
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Wilykitt said:
Pathetic little keyboard warrior 🤣

I didn't lose to anyone lad. You assume much. Back to your cave, tiny troll.
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:ROFLMAO:

Have a multi spec Bounty Hunter/Jedi is lore breaking, PvP min maxing play that isn't at home on Resto. It creates frustrating plays for the Jedi being hunted, and makes future balancing significantly harder.
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This is the type of forum statement that only comes from a Jedi that got beat. Deny it all you want, but I know real motivation when I see it. You got beat by a BH who was force sensitive, most likely near the village which only force sensitives can access so now you want it changed. This is not the first time I've seen this request as it was pretty common back when the game was live. The only part that was new was the "lore and immersion" angle as even jedi players back then wouldn't attempt such a ridiculous argument.

Repeat, major downvote.

Learn to adapt in a way that doesn't require running to the devs asking for a nerf.
 
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I ain't reading all that drama back and forth. Happy for you/my condolences. If you can fit being jedi/BH in your build at once, go for it. The game does not and cannot match lore perfectly. Your argument about it being lore breaking also isn't consistent with examples we've seen. I can understand that you're upset, there are many things that bug us. This is not the correct way to address these feelings.
 
FOC said:
1,) Making suggestions is not trolling.
2.) I already stated that would probably never happen.
3.) Adding questlines was not the reason for NGE failing. The gutting of professions and dropping it in a buggy state so soon after the Obi Wan expansion was why it failed..
4.) If you are so against NGE, why are you playing a version that has the NGE Legacy Questline? If you think that's fine, then what's the problem with adding other profession content?

Have a nice day as well and try not to be so salty.
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I am all for adding more content for other professions and can't wait for Nar Shadda. I also wish they could have somehow made BH along with Inquisitors into a trianlge they were going to and made an alpha BH that was only alpha against Jedi. You initial reply to the OP was the trolling part. I am 50/50 on the whole BH/Jedi piece and want to see what Knight and FRS brings with being able to drop the 24 SP at ranks above padawan.
 
jcan0918 said:
the whining and crying from the PV creator is disgusting , downvote !
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I'm not whining or crying. Suggesting something to make the BH/Jedi interaction better. It's the same vein as Defender being over tuned.

Happy to take this to Discord voice chat to discuss further. Or you can continue attacking me personally rather than my points, whatever tickles your pickle.
 
Tyr said:
I am all for adding more content for other professions and can't wait for Nar Shadda. I also wish they could have somehow made BH along with Inquisitors into a trianlge they were going to and made an alpha BH that was only alpha against Jedi. You initial reply to the OP was the trolling part. I am 50/50 on the whole BH/Jedi piece and want to see what Knight and FRS brings with being able to drop the 24 SP at ranks above padawan.
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Agreed entirely. The current balance is off, but the FRS will undoubtedly change things - this is why this PV is now defunct. It was discussed in the Jedi Only channel.

More content for all is always going to be better.
 
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You talk about breaking immersion, I say this would break roleplay options. I am no PvP master nor try to, but my understanding is, if I want to hunt Force Users, as a Force User, I have to go Bounty Hunter. And right now, the only Force User mechanic is Jedi, despite numerous Sith/Dark Side/Neutral users. So until Dark Side, Sith, Neutral or other mechanics are added, I have to actually vote this down. Sure, a Jedi teaming with Bounty Hunters against another Jedi can be cheesy or meta, but there are other ways to address this.
 
This only "lore breaks" for actual Good Guy Jedi. When Inquisitors release, and Sithers no longer have an excuse to be forced into Jedi, this "lore" subject will be viable. Until then just because it's called "Jedi," doesn’t mean it's "Jedi"
 
MageBlade said:
This only "lore breaks" for actual Good Guy Jedi. When Inquisitors release, and Sithers no longer have an excuse to be forced into Jedi, this "lore" subject will be viable. Until then just because it's called "Jedi," doesn’t mean it's "Jedi"
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I would say this works even for the good guy Jedi. They were sent many times to root out Sith. This effectively does the same thing. Good guy Jedi takes Imp Jedi mission to get the bad guy.
 
Actairr said:
I would say this works even for the good guy Jedi. They were sent many times to root out Sith. This effectively does the same thing. Good guy Jedi takes Imp Jedi mission to get the bad guy.
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Not to bust bubbles but that bit is wrong for this time frame. I mean arguably the strongest "Jedi" left alive hides in a swamp and stays hidden until he dies there.

According to the lore in this game's time and age, Jedi are almost nonexistent and are hunted, hated, and shunned by the vast majority of the population. The life of those who choose the way of the Force should be perilous, and they must be extremely careful to avoid being noticed as Jedi.

From this lore perspective, the Jedi's first goal should be to remain hidden and minimize any rumors about their presence. .
 
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